Subject: Re: the mbone experiment

From: George Michaelson <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 28 Aug 1997 10:31:10 +1000

I would much rather find a different, more interesting application to
  rally behind.  It should be something that could not have been done
  without multicast, and it should have some immediately obvious benefit
  to users.  Multicast porn is not the answer.
  
  -- arlie

Strong agreement. Here are some obvious suggestions:

1) tickertape. either literally emulate the stockline quote GUI or else
   the Times Square lights form, or just sideways scrolling text.

   then institute a moderated input by a large pool of volountary editors
   of one-line stories with embedded click-to-detail which does the
   browser-forced URL fetch on the active GUI of choice. 

2) feeds of highly compressable blow-by-blow for range of games.

	chess by GM's facing off, map into local display of board.
	embed commentary by *REAL* experts.

	play maps of interesting end-runs in the NFL. ditto commentary

	cricket scores and ditto commentary.

   this means finding a NPR to do the low-bw audio for the commentary and
   some experts, but think about the GUI and the audience size. NO VIDEO.
   (too soon. make that stage #2)

3) broadway and web-mbone fusion. embed arbitrary screen display into browser
   metaphor and combine remote control so people can do:

	long distance training for real-world apps like Excel/Word
	web-based slides instead of ppt for conferences with mbone plug-in.

4) split feed signals: send out video, possibly layered, but send
   lower ttl audio with local dub fill. ditto titles or other adjunct data

		"Get Ali:Frazier but with the voice-over in Parsi!"
		"Get overlay of "next blow coming here: graphics"
		"Get signal and a paint-tool to draw moustaches others can see"

5) large-group games/simulation apart from shoot-em-up:

	fully distributed shuttle launch desk simulator for spacenerds
	
	definately more fun to have a good sim of a desk, and know 100 other
	people are playing instead of a robot.

	mapping into MOOs

6) find wider interest topics for the regular MBONE broadcasts

	Douglas Adams/Minsky/Gore Vidal/Scott Adams/Dave Barry

 	I think the science is good, but its not going to get bums
	on seats for the ISPs. the pre-edited Stones feed wasn't really
	it either. Something erudite, with limited back-channel makes
	more sense. Like AOL/Compuslave hang-outs but more 'intellectual'

7) three flavours:

	inherently 1:1 usage. degenerate form of true multicast, using 
	the same transport method. Right now, often useful. vat to people
	as opposed to vat-to-groups. I live on mmcc.

	small group usage. n-way for n<20 with rich multi-way dialogue.
	scaling irrelevant because its under a reasonable limit. Possible
	to do via mrouted == possible to do as n-way unicast set. however
	its also widely distributed and might as well leverage off common
	core.

	large group usage. hundreds of participants. Right now, unlikely
	to be highly multi-way as a function of total poolsize. Might have
	twenties of participants, but more likely to be almost passive audience
	and one main broadcast.

		What can we do which makes one of these into a richer set
		of events? What kinds of social interaction fit into this
		class of traffic and inherently work well on multicast?

I don't see what class of activity that isn't centered on discourse which fits
a large-group/widely dispersed target audience/participant set. Ok, I do, but
it tends to be things like gambling, bingo (which is gambling), bull-pit
or auction-house bidding (which is essentially gambling).

Distributed orchestra? Could you re-assemble a set of SMPTE timestamped
feeds of music against a common centre metronome/conductor and present
every participant with an individual 'music-minus-one' to play with?

Actually, thats rather like the shuttle launch simulator in its back-end needs.

Scrabble? Monopoly? Risk? Cluedo?

-George
--
George Michaelson         |  connect.com.au pty/ltd
Email: [email-masked] |  c/o AAPT,
Phone: +61 7 3834 9976    |  level 8, the Riverside Centre,
  Fax: +61 7 3834 9908    |  123 Eagle St, Brisbane QLD 4000

---

From: Arlie Davis <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 16:44:41 -0700

> -----Original Message-----
> From:	Claude A. Cartee [SMTP:[email-masked]]
> Sent:	Wednesday, August 27, 1997 10:04 AM
> To:	Tony Li
> Cc:	[email-masked]; [email-masked]
> Subject:	Re: the mbone experiment 
> 
> The problem with your suggestion that you're trying to unseat an
> existing technology which performs the taks you describe, yet performs
> them 'better'.  What advantage does a 'digital' porn channel have over
> cable?
> 
What advantage does digital, multicasted porn have, say, over the real
thing?  I really hate the idea of working hard to bring a great
technology like multicast IP to fruition, just to provide a poor
substitute for sex.

Real sex is much cheaper, widely available (depending on your local
provider(s), of course), and is imminently more satisfying than grainy,
jerky MPEG video.

-- arlie